Boating Video Equipment?

[Paul H (admin)]

We have a lot of fun on the raids and HD cameras are quite affordable. I want to capture the Thames Raid and put together a video of the fun and frantics.

The Go Pro video system seems popular, waterproof to 40m. You can get a kit for £350
http://shop.gopro.com/EMEA/shopbyactivity/boating-bundle/boating-bundle-eu.html#/start=1

The Canon DSLR D100 is a similar cost, better lenses and HD Video; but not waterproof without a protective cover. The Canon will produce excellent still photos.

I wonder what people use - I think Pete was wearing a head cam on some of his canoe trips?

I want 1080 HD or better.

cheers
-Paul

[Timmo]

Depends what you want to do with the footage. 1080p is pretty standard now so you'll have a lot of choice and most will generate footage that is more than good enough fot YouTube, etc. Unless you are looking to create broadcast quality you may not have to spend too much to get what you need. 

I use a Canon 70d for stills and video. Captures decent footage and good stills. The 100d will be pretty similar. Really needs a tripod for good video though and with a decent zoom lens it's a relatively weighty piece of kit. When boating the need to keep it dry means it's often in a dry bag just when the shot you want appears. Though in a bigger boat with a cabin it might be easier to have it available. I also have a little Olympus waterproof thing that captures 1080p. Use that a lot because it's easy to have it handy. There's a good choice of similar waterproof compacts with similar spec.

Decent waterproof cases for SLRs tend to be expensive, don't accommodate larger lenses very well and generally get in the way of accessing the full functionality of the camera. The optical quality of the glass in front of the lens is also generally questionable. If you spend the money for a 5d body and the L series lenses they are water resistant (OK for rain etc.) but the cost is eyewatering.

GoPro has lots of advantages over SLR for videoing expeditions. Waterproof (very reassuring as well as good for water level shots) and light enough to stick on a pole to film yourself or on a helmet to do hands free POV shots. The kits that include a variety of brackets to mount it are well worth the investment. Also worth investing in plenty of memory cards. Make sure you get some sort of remote screen for it so you can see what it's filming otherwise you can get a lot of useless footage. 

My son's in Norway at the moment directing filming of a music video using Canon 5d MKIII and GoPro Hero4 cameras. That GoPro is able to shoot 4k, absolute top of the range but still not excruciatingly expensive. The Hero4 Michael's using talks to his smart phone so they're using that as a remote screen while the drone flies up fjords and over glaciers. 

I know less about the Hero3+ but I'm pretty sure it shoots 1080p no problem and also has wifi so can probably talk to phones/iPads as well. Should be dropping in price now the 4 is out. Models lower down the range will also probably do all you need but I've no experience of them.

When Michael is back from Norway I'm sure he'd be happy to talk through what kit is capable of what... his knowledge is encyclopaedic and he will know what quality you can get from what outfit.

Tim

On 21 Apr 2015, at 14:13, Paul (admin) [via UK HBBR Forum] <[hidden email]> wrote:

We have a lot of fun on the raids and HD cameras are quite affordable. I want to capture the Thames Raid and put together a video of the fun and frantics.

The Go Pro video system seems popular, waterproof to 40m. You can get a kit for £350
http://shop.gopro.com/EMEA/shopbyactivity/boating-bundle/boating-bundle-eu.html#/start=1

The Canon DSLR D100 is a similar cost, better lenses and HD Video; but not waterproof without a protective cover. The Canon will produce excellent still photos.

I wonder what people use - I think Pete was wearing a head cam on some of his canoe trips?

I want 1080 HD or better.

cheers
-Paul

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[Port-Na-Storm]

Paul,
I've got one of these, http://www.amazon.co.uk/Veho-VCC-005-MUVI-HDNPNG-Handsfree-ActionCam-Waterproof/dp/B008KFMVZY/ref=sr_1_5?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1429648308&sr=1-5&keywords=muvi+cameras

Its a poor man's gopro. The outfit I've got includes the waterproof case, remote control and all sorts of gizmos for mounting it in strange places. It has HD but I turn it down a notch which saves on storage and speeds up processing. I don't think you need HD unless you are going to watch it on your huge plasma telly. It you upload to youtube it'll strip it down anyway.
It doesn't have bluetooth or the facility to use a remote screen but when you're sailing a boat or paddling a canoe you haven't got time to look at it anyway. Does mean you shoot a lot of the sky and the bottom of the boat.
Here's one I made earlier.
https://youtu.be/sJ8vgdCQi7c

Grum.
     

[Paul H (admin)]

Thanks Timmo - I forgot your son was into film work.

The Go Pro Hero3 hits the sweet spot price wise, and does remote control/view on a phone or tablet. Its certainly rugged.

I could make a mount on MilliBee's sliding hatch, which should give a stable view of the river and locks, myself and the paddlers/rowers. If I get a DSLR I'll just be ready to disconnect it quickly if rain threatens.

I'm still interested how the others capture video....


-Paul

[Randonneur]

As Graham said, it's horses for courses!

I have no aspirations to produce broadcast quality video, neither have I the finances to do so!

Like Graham, I opted for the best of the cheap action cams (IMHO) the Mobius which was £40 when I got mine.

It was a toss up between that and the SJ400.(Go Pro clone)

At the time the Mobius suited my needs better, even though I had to lay out an extra £15 for the waterproof case (which does not get used regularly!)

Apart from the price, what sold it to me was the lens. Of all the action cams (which are of course fixed focal length) it offered the best compromise between field of view and barrel distortion. The extra few degrees width on many of the other cams (Go Pro included) gives unacceptable distortion when using the video raw and has to be corrected by post processing. This is not difficult but more of that in a minute. This is particularly relevant when there are masts involved. They are generally supposed to be straight (windsurfers and high tech rigs excepted).

If you are in the market for a cheap action cam, the best place to start is with the Techmoan reviews.

http://www.techmoan.com/

Here you'll see how the cameras actually perform (you can download raw video).

As I said, it was a toss up for me between the ubiquitous Mobius

https://youtu.be/7wmIyD1fM4M?list=PL9AE23A7F0C9FDC91

and the SJ400

https://youtu.be/uirzCD-qALE?list=PL9AE23A7F0C9FDC91

If I was to buy again today, the Wifi addition of the SJ400 might just swing it. My son has one and I'm quite impressed with it's performance.

Saying that the Mobius does absolutely everything I need, 1080p @ 30fps and fully configurable with an Android app and OTG USB lead.

Which brings me back to post processing.

Regardless of which camera you have, don't forget that you're going to need a machine with some serious grunt if you want to edit any of these files.

I know of people whose machines will not even play 1080p stuff never mind edit it!

I have an Intel i5-4670k based machine overclocked to 4.3Ghz, and even with 32GB of DDR RAM it's not exactly a flying machine when it comes to video editing and rendering! If you stretch beyond 1080p to 4k, then you're going to need serious processing power to make editing comfortable at all.

Bottom  line is consider your requirements and purchase accordingly!

For me it's the Mobius and my Samsung phone when I need some close up shots.

Next stage is getting my drone platform to do some proper cruising videos.

Some samples:

Pam with Mobius and some underwater shots!

https://youtu.be/U4OP73FKUp4

Close up stuff using the Samsung Galaxy K

https://youtu.be/yPTIbi5pMRM

How it's done from a DJI.

My local launch spot on the canal!

https://youtu.be/dOfsnkbSMLM

Cheers

PP

[Paul H (admin)]

Thanks Pete and others,

I want 1080 HD for my 39in Samsung LCD TV. I'm massively impressed by Freview HD, with good cameras and lighting some TV programmes produces stunning pictures. Likewise my daughters wedding HD video was shot and mixed by an Uncle who is a retired BBC Producer - it looks wonderful in 1080 HD.
I've seen a 4K TV in Argos and the detail is jaw dropping.

Don't forget I work in the artistic CAD-CAM business and we use Keyshot for high quality renderings. Keyshot was use by the Royal Mint for a short video of the new £2 coin, designed with the software I work on. We get judged by the quality of detail that our software can produce..blah..blah. blah.
So my personal standards are skewed by my job.

Back to reality the Techmoan website has excellent reviews and I do like the SJ4000 that Pete's son has. I'll check the Mobius later. As for barrel distortion I see it as an artistic effect and of course its the only way to capture everything that is happening......but things don't happen quickly at 3 knots down the Thames. At around £50 I can afford a Canon DSLR as well! he he

cheers
Paul

[Tomsk]

To throw another group of options into the mix....

I produce videos for YouTube. They call us YouTube Creators, but I'm just an average Joe with a hobby.

I've tried GoPro lookalikes but when it comes to the higher end of quality, they don't seem to hit the mark, especially in 1080p.  However in the GoPro seen I wouldn't bother with the current model.  Either a series 3 silver or 3+ black would do the job.  If you still want something like a DSLR too, consider the Canon EOS M.  It's a lightweight compact mirrorless system with excellent video capabilities and good lenses.  Buy it with the 18-55mm zoom lens for under £200.  It's cheap because it's been superseded, not because it's pants.  A handy converter let's you utilise ordinary canon DSLR lenses if need be.  Like the canon 70d mentioned in another post the EOS M has constant servo assist focus which is great for outdoor video work.

Just my two pence worth!

Tom

On 22 Apr 2015 11:26, "Paul (admin) [via UK HBBR Forum]" <[hidden email]> wrote:

Thanks Pete and others,

I want 1080 HD for my 39in Samsung LCD TV. I'm massively impressed by Freview HD, with good cameras and lighting some TV programmes produces stunning pictures. Likewise my daughters wedding HD video was shot and mixed by an Uncle who is a retired BBC Producer - it looks wonderful in 1080 HD.
I've seen a 4K TV in Argos and the detail is jaw dropping.

Don't forget I work in the artistic CAD-CAM business and we use Keyshot for high quality renderings. Keyshot was use by the Royal Mint for a short video of the new £2 coin, designed with the software I work on. We get judged by the quality of detail that our software can produce..blah..blah. blah.
So my personal standards are skewed by my job.

Back to reality the Techmoan website has excellent reviews and I do like the SJ4000 that Pete's son has. I'll check the Mobius later. As for barrel distortion I see it as an artistic effect and of course its the only way to capture everything that is happening......but this don't happen quickly at 3 knots down the Thames. At around £50 I can afford a Canon DSLR as well! he he

cheers
Paul

Sail when you can, motor when you can't http://www.millibee.com

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NAML

[Paul H (admin)]

Tomsk,

I looked at the Canon EOS-M, nice, but for another £75 I can get a Nikon DSLR that shoots HD video.

Wifey used to have one of the rubbish 35mm compacts in the mid 80s. She went into Dixons in the sales for a better camera, salesman produced a Pentax Film SLR and she said "that looks like a real camera, I want it".
We never looked back and took hundreds of excellent photos, it got dragged all over Arizona in the early 90s, took fantastic photos of the myriad of different colours in the Grand Canyon through the seasons, dropped the aluminium body several times and it still works perfectly. The only problem is the film processing.

The best feature is the Penta-prism that never lies to you through the eyepiece, showing dynamic shutter speed and F-stop, with crystal clear lens focusing far superior to a pixelated screen (for which I need to find my glasses).

We bought our oldest daughter a Pentax istD with AF for her 18th. Just as good as the old Pentax but with a plastic body, so I would not want to drop it!

-Paul

[Tomsk]

You can't beat old 35mm.  I still use my Olympus OM2, bought for me second hand in the late 70's.  As good today as it was then.

The reason I suggest the EOS M is size and weight and current cost.  The suggestion was made within the context of this thread, for suitable raid cameras.  If this was for a budding photographer and the general 'hobby' of photo taking there are far better options, as you quite rightly suggest.  The EOS M is a quite a good camera in it's own right, standing up well against the Nikon and Canon offerings at the entry levels - maybe similar to the Canon 700d, except the EOS M is mirrorless therefore lighter and a little more robust.  At <£200 (body and zoom lens) I rank it highly.  I use mine daily in a high dust environment (no water testing unfortunately) and it's not let me down yet.  I would never treat my DSLR the same way - too many ingress points!

Tom 

On Thu, Apr 23, 2015 at 9:20 PM, Paul (admin) [via UK HBBR Forum] <[hidden email]> wrote:

Tomsk,

I looked at the Canon EOS-M, nice, but for another £75 I can get a Nikon DSLR.

Wifey used to have one of the rubbish 35mm compacts in the mid 80s. She went into Dixons in the sales for a better camera, salesman produced a Pentax Film SLR and she said "that looks like a real camera, I want it".
We never looked back and took hundreds of excellent photos, it got dragged all over Arizona in the early 90s, took fantastic photos of the myriad of different colours in the Grand Canyon through the seasons, dropped the aluminium body several times and it still works perfectly. The only problem is the film processing.

The best feature is the Penta-prism that never lies to you through the eyepiece, showing dynamic shutter speed and F-stop, with crystal clear lens focusing far superior to a pixelated screen (for which I need to find my glasses).

We bought our oldest daughter a Pentax istD with AF for her 18th. Just as good as the old Pentax but with a plastic body, so I would not want to drop it!

-Paul

Sail when you can, motor when you can't http://www.millibee.com

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NAML

[Randonneur]

Paul,
hopefully you're all sorted for a week of HQ video shooting.
I'm just deciding whether it's worth bringing Lily along to help out



https://youtu.be/4vGcH0Bk3hg

Only a week to go...
Pete

[AdrianG]

Wowser!

How long 'til there's one you can swallow?!

AG

[Alan]

AdrianG wrote

Wowser!

How long 'til there's one you can swallow?!

AG

http://www.gizmag.com/fda-approval-pillcam-colon/30740/

[Port-Na-Storm]

Wowsers Trousers.
I think you've gone a bit off-piste there Alan.

[Randonneur]

Well, after the great flurry of activity, I didn't see much evidence of HQ videos being shot on this years Raid.
I wait to be proven wrong...
As I thought we'd have an epic record, I only used my little Mobius on a few discrete occasions.

I quickly pieced together the few clips that escaped the cutting room floor.
If I don't do it now, I will never find the time later

I think I got nearly everyone in the "movie".
If you need more coverage you need to travel closer to Bram...


http://youtu.be/LzV0vDlmstE
Cheers
Pete

[Chris Partridge]

Pete...that is totally brilliant. If you don't get a BAFTA there is no justice. It encapsulates a great, great week. Thanks. And thanks to all of you who made the week such fun.
All best
Chris

[AdrianG]

Hear, hear. Well done, Pete - really good - some really nice looking shots there. Gosh, doesn't it all look summery and pleasant?!
Kind regards
Adrian

[Timmo]

And my vote of thanks too Pete. 

I'd only shown my wife pictures with the rain lashing down before to make sure she understood we didn't do this for pleasure. The shots of me relaxing at Abingdon lock and scenes of imbibing at pubs, let alone evidence that there was sunshine, have rather undermined the message!

Nice memories though.

Tim.

On 21 Jun 2015, at 07:09, AdrianG [via UK HBBR Forum] <[hidden email]> wrote:

Hear, hear. Well done, Pete - really good - some really nice looking shots there. Gosh, doesn't it all look summery and pleasant?!
Kind regards
Adrian

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NAML