Open for global business?

[Paul H (admin)]

This forum is setup so the entire world can see everything - messages and lists of users (but not personal details).

We could lock down to 405 registered users, or down to 297 members (who have been "approved").

I just wondered how you all feel about this?

Paul

[Tomsk]

I'm a lurker.... I joined the forum many years ago when I started building an SF dingy.  Since then I became ill and ended up in a wheelchair.  I still have the unfinished boat and follow the forum to keep my dreams of finishing the build alive.  If you lock people like me out of your world it would be a crying shame.

I must ask though why so many feel the need for seclusion?  If it wasn't for forums and groups like yours I may have never had my dream in the first place!

Tom

On Mon, May 4, 2020 at 7:42 AM Paul (admin) [via UK HBBR Forum] <[hidden email]> wrote:

This forum is setup so the entire world can see everything - messages and lists of users (but not personal details).

We could lock down to 405 registered users, or down to 297 members (who have been "approved").

I just wondered how you all feel about this?

Paul

---

If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the discussion below:

http://uk-hbbr-forum.967333.n3.nabble.com/Open-for-global-business-tp4031488.html

To start a new topic under General Discussion, email [hidden email]
To unsubscribe from UK HBBR Forum, click here.
NAML

[Matt Cunningham]

Sounds interesting!

Who are “registered “ and “approved “ users ?

Keep up the good work!

Thanks,

Matthew Cunningham 


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone

On Monday, May 4, 2020, 7:42 am, Paul (admin) [via UK HBBR Forum] <[hidden email]> wrote:

This forum is setup so the entire world can see everything - messages and lists of users (but not personal details).

We could lock down to 405 registered users, or down to 297 members (who have been "approved").

I just wondered how you all feel about this?

Paul

---

If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the discussion below:

http://uk-hbbr-forum.967333.n3.nabble.com/Open-for-global-business-tp4031488.html

To start a new topic under General Discussion, email [hidden email]
To unsubscribe from UK HBBR Forum, click here.
NAML

[Timmo]

Not sure what the reason for making the site private would be... though I'll pay attention if I'm told. Otherwise my vote is for staying public.

Tim.

On 4 May 2020, at 08:22, Matt Cunningham [via UK HBBR Forum] <[hidden email]> wrote:

Sounds interesting!

Who are “registered “ and “approved “ users ?

Keep up the good work!

Thanks,

Matthew Cunningham 


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone

On Monday, May 4, 2020, 7:42 am, Paul (admin) [via UK HBBR Forum] <<a href="x-msg://5/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&amp;node=4031490&amp;i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow" link="external" class="">[hidden email]> wrote:

This forum is setup so the entire world can see everything - messages and lists of users (but not personal details).

We could lock down to 405 registered users, or down to 297 members (who have been "approved").

I just wondered how you all feel about this?

Paul

---

If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the discussion below:

http://uk-hbbr-forum.967333.n3.nabble.com/Open-for-global-business-tp4031488.html

To start a new topic under General Discussion, email <a href="x-msg://5/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&amp;node=4031490&amp;i=1" target="_top" rel="nofollow" link="external" class="">[hidden email]
To unsubscribe from UK HBBR Forum, click here.
NAML

---

If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the discussion below:

http://uk-hbbr-forum.967333.n3.nabble.com/Open-for-global-business-tp4031488p4031490.html

To start a new topic under General Discussion, [hidden email]
To unsubscribe from UK HBBR Forum, click here.
NAML

[Port-Na-Storm]

I don't really understand why we would be asking the question, at this or any other time.

The forum has existed for ten years in its current form, I am a moderator and I am not aware of there ever being a problem.

The Internet has the power to break down boundaries and allow ordinary people to share their hopes dreams and aspirations, let's not erect unnecessary barriers.

Spread the good word, keep it open.

Be Safe Everyone.

Graham

Sent from my Xperia by Sony smartphone

---- Timmo [via UK HBBR Forum] wrote ----

Not sure what the reason for making the site private would be... though I'll pay attention if I'm told. Otherwise my vote is for staying public.

Tim.

On 4 May 2020, at 08:22, Matt Cunningham [via UK HBBR Forum] <[hidden email]> wrote:

Sounds interesting!

Who are “registered “ and “approved “ users ?

Keep up the good work!

Thanks,

Matthew Cunningham 


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone

On Monday, May 4, 2020, 7:42 am, Paul (admin) [via UK HBBR Forum] <<a href="x-msg://5/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&amp;node=4031490&amp;i=0"; target="_top" rel="nofollow" link="external" class="">[hidden email]> wrote:

This forum is setup so the entire world can see everything - messages and lists of users (but not personal details).

We could lock down to 405 registered users, or down to 297 members (who have been "approved").

I just wondered how you all feel about this?

Paul

---

If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the discussion below:

http://uk-hbbr-forum.967333.n3.nabble.com/Open-for-global-business-tp4031488.html

To start a new topic under General Discussion, email <a href="x-msg://5/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&amp;node=4031490&amp;i=1"; target="_top" rel="nofollow" link="external" class="">[hidden email]
To unsubscribe from UK HBBR Forum, click here.
NAML

---

If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the discussion below:

http://uk-hbbr-forum.967333.n3.nabble.com/Open-for-global-business-tp4031488p4031490.html

To start a new topic under General Discussion, [hidden email]
To unsubscribe from UK HBBR Forum, click here.
NAML

[David Bewick]

I think it is important that anyone with an interest in home boat building should be able to see for themselves the sort of nonsense we all spout on here.  Unless there are major issues of security that need to be fixed, please keep it as it is.

[Chris Waite]

I agree with everyone else here Paulie

Where did this sudden urge for limitation come from?  We have always been entirely open and unfettered.

It ain't broke, so don't fix it

Chris W

[inwe]

I completely concur with Chris. If it ain't broke don't change it !
Richard

[Reinhold]

Good morning ,
Please keep public as it is.
I agree with all who have already answered and who asked for not to change this 'running system' .

Even if I did not contirbute anything since long, this blog , your discussions and your projects was very important for me to keep the contact to own boat building and boating dreams.
Many thanks

[simplesimon]

I vote stay public
Simon

[Matt Cunningham]

I don’t get the need for changes.  The DCA has always been inclusive without much need for marshalling.

I’m with the general consensus  of the thread so far.

Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone

On Monday, May 4, 2020, 11:38 am, simplesimon [via UK HBBR Forum] <[hidden email]> wrote:

I vote stay public
Simon

---

If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the discussion below:

http://uk-hbbr-forum.967333.n3.nabble.com/Open-for-global-business-tp4031488p4031497.html

To start a new topic under General Discussion, email [hidden email]
To unsubscribe from UK HBBR Forum, click here.
NAML

[Paul H (admin)]

Thank you all for the quick replies, especially the lurkers. Public is the clear majority, and it will stay that way!

EU GDPR rules are like a plate of spaghetti, but may require someone to oversee user data security, i.e. determine what is sensitive data and protect it from hackers and malicious attackers. As long as one member is an EU citizen, GDPR applies. Timmo is sitting on the fence!

Clearly the view is that no messages are sensitive; email addresses are hidden by Nabble anyway and usernames can be depersonalised.

There you go, EU bureaucratic business 2020 sorted in a few hours.

Cheers
Paul

PS Registered Users are anyone that registered with an email. Members have been approved by a moderator to be "boaty" and only members can post.

PPS There are a few dormant registered users (who are not members) with random usernames and dodgy email addresses, who may have been created by bots to spy on us, hoping to find emails which they won't.
The blatant spammers are banned and tactically nuked.

[Jeremy]

I'm an admin on a forum that has a few thousand members, and we've looked at possible GDPR impact and found that we didn't need to do anything much more than we already were to remain compliant.  Terms and conditions of use need slight amendment, so that people know what they are signing up to, and the other main issue is around control and management of content, which is really as much about sensible moderation as anything else.

User security and basic data privacy is now baked in to most forum software, making things easier, but forum staff, who have elevated access rights, need to be aware of what they can and cannot do.  The hardest conundrum we've faced so far is when a user asks for their account and all content they've created to be deleted, under the "right to erasure".  It can be very messy trying to tidy up threads that end up with gaping holes in them from deleted content.  The probably non-compliant bodge is to delete the user details and anonymise their content.  That leaves threads readable, but probably still breaches the regulations, as the content remains the copyright of the person that posted it.

Copyright can be a thorny topic on it's own, though, although not one that forum administrators often need to worry too much about, as content remains the copyright of the original author, unless specifically reassigned.

The bottom line is that as long as users have to opt in to the limited user data kept by a forum, then the rest of the stuff needed for compliance isn't too onerous.

[alopenboat]

On 4 May 2020 at 4:47, Paul (admin) [via UK HBBR Forum] wrote:

> EU GDPR rules are like a plate of spaghetti, but /may/ require someone
> to oversee user data security, i.e. determine what is sensitive data
> and protect it from hackers and malicious attackers. As long as one
> member is an EU citizen, GDPR applies. Timmo is sitting on the fence!

We may all still be EU citizens. See
<https://www.dacbeachcroft.com/en/gb/news/2020/april/dac-beachcroft-fi
les-landmark-case-with-general-court-of-the-eu-on-behalf-of-a-group-of
-uk-nationals/>

--
Sail when you can, row when you must, motor only
when you have to be at work in the morning.

Alastair Law
Yeovil, England.
<http://www.little.jim.freeuk.com>



--
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
https://www.avg.com

[GregHBBR]

Paul (admin) wrote

Thank you all for the quick replies, especially the lurkers. Public is the clear majority, and it will stay that way!

Eminently sensible decision!

EU GDPR rules are like a plate of spaghetti, but may require someone to oversee user data security,

It's more a case that some people, such as those who sometimes deliberately misquote Health & Safety safety legislation to keep their life simple, make GDPR appear complicated. In this case there is no MAY about it. GDPR does not apply as no personal data is held by the forum administrators.

The GDPR is a set of regulations about personal data. The forum holds none! The only data element that might be regarded as personal is an email address, but an email address only becomes personal when linked to a real name, telephone number, or some other item of traceable personal data. A username is not such an item as it is a volatile label that can be changed at will by a user and is not irrevocably linked with personal data held elsewhere. Therefore, there is no GDPR implication.

Further, the administrators have no duty of care or obligation, under GDPR, to hide any personal data that a user of the forum may choose to publish here. The GDPR does not prevent users publishing what they want about themselves.

PS Registered Users are anyone that registered with an email.

Or more precisely, a "registered user" is a forum user who has confirmed they have control of the given email address, through the process of clicking on a link in an email sent to the given address.

Members have been approved by a moderator to be "boaty" and only members can post.

Correction: Moderators have no right to assign users to the Members group. Only those in the Administrators group have that right.

PPS There are a few dormant registered users (who are not members) with random usernames and dodgy email addresses, who may have been created by bots to spy on us, hoping to find emails which they won't.
The blatant spammers are banned and tactically nuked.

Clarification: Only the Administrators have access to users' email addresses.
Explanation: "Tactically nuked" means are not added to the "Members" group and therefore refused posting rights. The Administrators will judge whether a forum user is a spammer when that user posts on an "Access Request" screen asking to be allowed to post. Administrators may also "ban" a user. All banning does is prevent them from logging in with their registered email address, but that does not stop them re-registering with a different email address.

Anyone can see which users are in which groups by checking the lists provided under the "People" link.

[Paul H (admin)]

Thanks for the clarifications Greg.

For about half the members their real names can be gleaned or guessed, with their email that adds up to "personal data". So I don't think personal data has a binary state here, more a fuzzy fraction depending on how much users have depersonalised their usernames. But I understand your point.

The member's views are clear and we got a good selection of high and low posters. I'll lock the topic in a day or two.

Stay well
Paul

[GregHBBR]

Hi Paul,

Paul (admin) wrote

For about half the members their real names can be gleaned or guessed, with their email that adds up to "personal data".

What you, and fellow administrators, can see and may be able to guess, is not covered under GDPR. No other forum user else has access to that data - and as all material posted on the forum, under Nabble's Terms and Conditions, becomes Nabble's to do with what they want, you needn't worry too much and any liability yourself.

You are in danger of falling foul of the same hysteria that has gripped those who quote Elfin Safety at you constantly. I do understand your desire for caution, but "gleaning" and "guessing" is not part of the law. The forum does not hold personal data. Users may post personal data. The forum's administrators does not need to censor or protect (depending on your viewpoint) those users.

There is a reason why a certain person uses the handle @realDonaldTrump on Twitter. How many other variations do you suppose exist? Guessing personal data is not part of the GDPR.

[Chris Waite]

I wasn't going to raise a problem Jeremy

But as we seem to be deeply into the subject of legalities, early on in my topic on Evolving Polly Wee, you posted a picture of a Falmouth workboat called Victory - 15th April 2012 - Evolving Polly Wee page 8.  In the last three months or so, the photographer acquired my email address through this forum and accused me of 'lifting' his image.  He hadn't even bothered to check the dates, or the orginator of the post and a 'robust' exchange followed, after which he seems to have settled down.

Paulie has removed the image in question, but it behoves people to be careful what they glean off the internet.

Chris W

[Jeremy]

The potentially personally identifiable data that is pretty much always held by any forum package, and accessible to administrators/moderators can be IP addresses, together with email addresses, or so we were advised.  I've questioned this, given that some people will have dynamic IP addresses and some may use a VPN, but the legal advice was that it only takes one member to have an IP that is tied to their identity to make this personal data.

[Jeremy]

Bugger, I learned to sail on that boat, back when she was owned by Toby West, and should have realised the copyright thing.  Sorry, Chris, a definite boo boo on my part.